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Zeppelin  
#1 Posted : Wednesday, April 3, 2024 5:16:38 PM(UTC)
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Daz has announced an AI version/helper/add on?  called AI Studio:


https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/#inbox/FMfcgzGxSbmJkbztbLHlvzDlsFlfwjnH


Chaosophia  
#2 Posted : Wednesday, April 3, 2024 9:38:45 PM(UTC)
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<p>I was under the impression it was going to be a plugin for Studio that would use your bought content to create the best prompt available without having to set up a scene (Make Art Button) with possibility to buy content for the image, or rent the use of imagery from a data base of Daz images of the products, instead of a Midjourney like on site generator. IMHO it seems to gimmicky and a cash grab on the AI hype. With Stable Diffusion being well free, if you have the space and graphics to run it. I was running it slowly on a 2GB graphics card at first for slow images, Even with the sub price of 3.99/month it just is another subscription that more than likely will be unused as AI progresses and becomes more fine tuned.&nbsp;</p>


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Zeppelin on 4/4/2024(UTC), yakitoo on 4/7/2024(UTC)
gooHero  
#3 Posted : Thursday, April 4, 2024 1:34:04 AM(UTC)
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We desperately need innovation in Daz to make it relevant (not keep it, as it isn't), as engines such as the Unreal Engine is making leaps and bounds. What do we get? an obsolete AI tool.

This is the most stupid shizzle I have seen in a long time. You can't even friggin' copy keys in the timeline in Daz without having to wait what feels like 5-10 minutes for it to update, only for it to totally fudge up your animation until you make all the keys linear and then TCB again, and this has been a problem from when I started animating in 2018. We need BASIC physics in Daz instead of the atrocious dforce garbage, but we get AI tools. GREAT xD If sunk cost wasn't a thing I would've ditched this trash fire program a long time ago. They are just antagonizing us at this point. in 2023 in between january and september (google) 73% of all internet traffic consisted of bot activity, how is another AI tool going to help with the already atrocious conditions for artists trying to make a living off of this. I am not trying to make a living off of it, but I get enraged on their behalf. I hope they crash and burn sooner than later so that we can all move on.

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Zeppelin on 4/4/2024(UTC), yakitoo on 4/7/2024(UTC)
ZenMaster3D  
#4 Posted : Friday, April 5, 2024 1:21:26 PM(UTC)
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I still stand behind my general opinion regarding the current 'AI' which is "overhyped sales model".


Seen the introduction video?  They're even trying to "sell" plain image editing as if it were part of the 3D working experience. That alone should tell you something.


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Pushee-Ri on 4/8/2024(UTC)
Chaosophia  
#5 Posted : Friday, April 5, 2024 1:31:41 PM(UTC)
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I am actually quite surprised they didn't try to push their nfts with this release. 


wurger  
#6 Posted : Friday, April 5, 2024 5:38:43 PM(UTC)
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I'm not a huge fan of AI, but I'm leaning that direction for environments and backgrounds to comp my characters over. My 4070 GPU keeps limiting what I want to add to a scene, and can't justify a 4090 for what money I make from Daz renders.
Bumper2  
#7 Posted : Saturday, April 6, 2024 3:52:14 PM(UTC)
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AI can do some amazing things. Daz using AI does not. It's a broken system, that they knew was broken, and does not work.


We're seeing the end of the Daz era. Not because people aren't using it but because they are desperate to make any kind of money. They've been latching onto the 'latest' craze for a while now. It started with NFTs and now it's gone to this. Daz makes money hand over fist but their shareholders expect a rise every quarter. Poser is still out there, still doing good works, but Daz is now surviving on only already invested money. Like gooHero said, if not for the fact that many of us have sunk a substantial amount of money into it already it would have fizzled long ago.


They've shown they don't respect artists or art.


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gooHero on 4/7/2024(UTC), sentionaut on 4/8/2024(UTC)
gooHero  
#8 Posted : Sunday, April 7, 2024 3:39:13 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Bumper2 Go to Quoted Post


AI can do some amazing things. Daz using AI does not. It's a broken system, that they knew was broken, and does not work.


We're seeing the end of the Daz era. Not because people aren't using it but because they are desperate to make any kind of money. They've been latching onto the 'latest' craze for a while now. It started with NFTs and now it's gone to this. Daz makes money hand over fist but their shareholders expect a rise every quarter. Poser is still out there, still doing good works, but Daz is now surviving on only already invested money. Like gooHero said, if not for the fact that many of us have sunk a substantial amount of money into it already it would have fizzled long ago.


They've shown they don't respect artists or art.



 


I too like the technology, but the way people are already abusing and misusing it for a quick buck is ridiculous; if you go to DeviantArt the only information you get from the admin team there, is how much "artists" make off of their AI "art" - in fact the last three notifications I got was about that. The "artist" of the month was also an AI one button push charlatan X) and you can't even block them because it is an admin team. It's all about money. When I pointed out the fact that the AI tools presented on the Daz main site drove me to learn Blender instead on the Daz main forums, it was just shadowbanned xD they have no defenses left and they know they are selling out. They are done. AI will crush Daz in the long run, whereas you are at least able to be kind of relevant in Blender where you can focus on collision, inflation and beautiful lighting. I genuinely started learning Blender instead. And while the money I have used on Daz is not entirely wasted, it will be a giant pain in the ass porting what I need. I have maybe 25-30 "OC" characters that I like, and even with autorigging it is a hassle. I wish I knew as much in 2018 that I might as well just learn Blender instead from the get-go.


BigBlueProstatePoker  
#9 Posted : Sunday, April 7, 2024 11:48:50 AM(UTC)
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My burning question is who in their right mind ever said "Hey, you know what AI is missing? Daz figures! That's what would make AI better!"

The usual Daz ass lickers are like "Hey, it's ethically sourced AI. It's better than the other AI platforms!" Lol, it's still Stable Diffusion. The LORA is Daz figures, but it's still Stable Diffusion. Have no doubts about it being "ethical".

Daz is the only company that seems to want to do anything but what it's supposed to be doing. It's a shame, for all that they can do, they just keeping chase the latest fad and trying to make Daz relevant by sticking the same Daz content into it, but missing the mark every time.

Daz is slowly turning into Smith Micro at this point.
Chaosophia  
#10 Posted : Sunday, April 7, 2024 2:46:22 PM(UTC)
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Pun intended but I was just thinking since they are owned or own Tafi, would that make em Laffy Taffy now. I swear sometimes I don't understand the jokes they put out but makes sense With the Gen 9 figure, NFTs. Could those be the lame dad jokes on the packaging. Maybe it's no longer about art with them, and more about making digital knockoff of Laffy Taffy. 


I hate my brain sometimes....


Pushee-Ri  
#11 Posted : Monday, April 8, 2024 3:23:45 AM(UTC)
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If you take a close look at the DAZ AI promo video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USA5pD3Q2jA

at 0:24 you can see that DAZ follows the well-known principle:
AI is only AI if the model has (or gets) at least 6 fingers ;-)
sentionaut  
#12 Posted : Monday, April 8, 2024 10:50:03 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Bumper2 Go to Quoted Post


AI can do some amazing things. Daz using AI does not. It's a broken system, that they knew was broken, and does not work.


We're seeing the end of the Daz era. Not because people aren't using it but because they are desperate to make any kind of money. They've been latching onto the 'latest' craze for a while now. It started with NFTs and now it's gone to this. Daz makes money hand over fist but their shareholders expect a rise every quarter. Poser is still out there, still doing good works, but Daz is now surviving on only already invested money. Like gooHero said, if not for the fact that many of us have sunk a substantial amount of money into it already it would have fizzled long ago.


They've shown they don't respect artists or art.



It's kind of amazing how consistent they've been about wanting to be anything except what they're good at, but man. I'm just not going to be giving any money to a company that is so obviously high on tech grift going forward. I do believe they think they're doing the right thing for artists, but that's what's spooky; like most investors in the crypto/NFT/genAI/Web3/multiverse circle, their corporate imagination only extends to a world where art and tech merge at such a high level that indvidual artists can also attract venture capital investments in our Content™, just like every other creative entity that gets bought out and liquidated for short-term profit.


gooHero  
#13 Posted : Wednesday, April 10, 2024 3:30:37 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: sentionaut Go to Quoted Post


Originally Posted by: Bumper2 Go to Quoted Post


AI can do some amazing things. Daz using AI does not. It's a broken system, that they knew was broken, and does not work.


We're seeing the end of the Daz era. Not because people aren't using it but because they are desperate to make any kind of money. They've been latching onto the 'latest' craze for a while now. It started with NFTs and now it's gone to this. Daz makes money hand over fist but their shareholders expect a rise every quarter. Poser is still out there, still doing good works, but Daz is now surviving on only already invested money. Like gooHero said, if not for the fact that many of us have sunk a substantial amount of money into it already it would have fizzled long ago.


They've shown they don't respect artists or art.



It's kind of amazing how consistent they've been about wanting to be anything except what they're good at, but man. I'm just not going to be giving any money to a company that is so obviously high on tech grift going forward. I do believe they think they're doing the right thing for artists, but that's what's spooky; like most investors in the crypto/NFT/genAI/Web3/multiverse circle, their corporate imagination only extends to a world where art and tech merge at such a high level that indvidual artists can also attract venture capital investments in our Content™, just like every other creative entity that gets bought out and liquidated for short-term profit.



I think they are also desperate for ways to monetize the existing consumer base, as there won't be "more" people as such going forward, because of the decreasing birthrates coupled with people getting older, because of medicine (and they are not interested in buying their stuff). That is also why we see so many things that we do not OWN anymore. Movies, music, games, heck even subscriptions for features in Mercedes or BMW locked behind software is a thing. Everything is leased now; so that when you cancel your subscription to fx Netflix, you can't see it when you want to, like you could when you owned it on a DVD, so you are forced to continually pay them money to access it.


I have 300+ games on Steam, but many of them are now live service games, which I cannot access if I do not have an internet connection. Same for Diablo 3 and 4, for example, on Battlenet. I wanted to re-watch some stuff recently because I was bored; but I can't, because I won't pay for 3-4 different streaming sites, where the licenses are currently holed up at... All my music is tied up on apple servers somewhere, and I can barely access them as it is now, because their servers are so slow to respond; but at least I could download them all if I wanted; but it takes up quite a lot of space.


From google: "By 2050, Africa's population will increase to an unprecedented 2.4 billion and eventually to a staggering 4.2 billion by 2100. The continent will nearly become the most populated on earth; trailing only Asia's 4.8 billion", but we assume that they have the same purchasing power as they do now, which is very low; so that won't really be a market where all the different companies, that depend on mass (META, X and similar) can expand in the same way. This is the best case scenario, but if the tension we see in the world now between the different factions increase and ultimately results in a third world war, then the population will be lower (I assume), and us in the west won't have time to buy their shit anymore as we are busy staying alive, so they have to do it now before everything implodes (internationalization is also on the way out). There aren't more people to tap into for them (META realized that some time ago).


So what do they do? they have to monetize us who already paid a bunch to be here even more. Pay for our Daz AI knock-off; pay for our unoptimized bloated Daz assets that noone bothers to check before release; pay for Netflix every month, pay for news, pay for wikipedia, pay for your car having automatic long/short beam, pay for radio, pay for rent instead of owning a house..... pay for everything on a monthly basis, instead of a one-off payment, so that they get continual revenue and exposure. That is the way we are headed people, and it is sad to see. Just look at the real estate market.


Sorry for the rant, but I have had a long time to take this in, and where we are headed generally, and damn it if it isn't a VERY dark place. The rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer, and the middle class disappearing entirely. I feel bad for the children getting born post 2020, they are in for a rough time. AI will NOT help with this, as I don't think that anyone will use it for good. Just yesterday a reporter herein my country released an article where he exposed the government for using 27 different AI-run algorithms on its citizens; with 7 of those being run on "undisclosed" information about us... THAT is what they will use AI for; more control and crime; and a combination thereof.


Why do good with a thing that could help us with achieving even 50% of a utopia, when they can use it to enrich the already wealthy and powerful with even more, right!?



Bumper2  
#14 Posted : Wednesday, April 10, 2024 5:54:32 AM(UTC)
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The thing is, the rich never wanted a middle class. They always wanted slaves. Be it wage slaves, actual slaves, indentured servants, 99% of us are born, live and die so they can live in comfort and excess. AI is a great idea in theory, but just like most philosophical theories it breaks down when used by humans. A hammer is a great tool, it can help build amazing things. It can also end lives. Any tool - of which AI currently is - is only as useful as those who wield them.

When we had the AI discussion several months ago I wrote how I was already conflicted. I won't use it personally but several artists on here have used it for absolutely amazing work. There is absolutely nothing wrong with any of that. The problem comes when the rich use it to further exclude anyone who isn't them. They use it that way all the time. One of the last bastions of holdout was that they couldn't affect artists, they needed artists to market and create. Artists, to them, are a middle man. They want to get past any middle man they can. I'm an artist. I'm also in construction. Did you know they are trying to automate every construction trade? 3D printers are building concrete houses, modular skyscrapers are rising to the sky. Why deal with pesky unions when you can destroy them by grinding them out?

The SAG-AFTRA strike in cinema was built on that exact thing. They were fighting back against AI being used to take their likenesses and voices forever in the future. I've been offered roles where I had to sign away the rights to my face and likeness in perpetuity. That was background work. Why hire extras when you can just digitally insert them from the last few decades?

The problem is NOT AI. AI is a tool. The problem is who wields the tool and what they plan to do with it. Will they pound in a nail or will they pound in your skull.
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gooHero on 4/10/2024(UTC)
gooHero  
#15 Posted : Thursday, April 11, 2024 6:33:42 AM(UTC)
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_D2P4sXRoI 26:50 :-D a perfect example. From Pink Floyd themselves. So.... it's A okay for us to just pirate their music. Got it! I have seen 3-4 examples of this just in the last couple of days.


 


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oT0jNiPrOEc

Edited by user Thursday, April 11, 2024 1:41:57 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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