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Lednah  
#1 Posted : Wednesday, July 11, 2018 9:54:57 AM(UTC)
Lednah

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Folks, I am trying to create for my own use (not for sale as per se) a micro string bikini similar to those on this photo. My problem is the string in the back crack always twists and even enters inside the mesh. A tutorial how to make such item in Marvelous designer will be highly appreciated.


 

Lednah attached the following image(s):
1122_ha-dentra-3041.JPG
Draxin  
#2 Posted : Thursday, July 12, 2018 1:11:51 PM(UTC)
Draxin

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I've had similar issues with thong or string style pieces. Though I currently don't have access to MD. I use the subscription version. I remember that anything smaller than 20 mm wide will slip into the mesh of the avatar in that area.


There are a couple ways to fix it, depending on your MD Version and if your using the supplied MD Avatars or imported Avatars.


The most resent version of MD added a feature that can smooth the avatar, basically subdivides the polys. Click on any part of the avatar in the 3D view, then look in the Properties pane. Avatar smoothing should be at the bottom. Though I'd be careful doing this, especially if you save as a Project. As it reloads the smoothed Avatar, but doesn't save the smoothed value in the Property Pane. Also may try adjusting the collision offset to the avatar.


It may also be a case of too much tension from the crotch area to the top of the back part of the bottom. Could try lengthening it a bit. Also if it's a single piece in the pattern window you can add an internal line and adjust the fold strength and degree. If it's a stitched (2 pieces) you can adjust the fold strength and degree with the Edit Sewing.


Sorry I can't be much help with the MD supplied Avatars, since I don't use them, and don't remember if the "cheeks" of the bottom actually collide.


I know that my imported Genesis 3 and 8 Models the glutes part of the mesh actually intersect causing some serious "Collision Confusion". the best way I found to fix that is before I export the model I use a morph that spreads them. Then I export it and create an Avatar with a more open space back there. It's not really realistic, I know, but it's the only fix I found to eliminate the "Collision Confusion". From what I've figured out is if the polys of the avatar are intersecting or even too close together (Sharp Bends) it causes problems.


Oh, just remembered, you can also try decreasing the Particle Distance of your Pattern as well. Decreasing the particle distance increases the poly count and sewing threads of the pattern, unfortunately this also increases the resources needed to simulate the Draping (or lack of in this case).


Hope this was helpful, without having my subscription on this is the best I can do from memory, which is not very good even on good days. lol

Lednah  
#3 Posted : Thursday, July 12, 2018 4:03:17 PM(UTC)
Lednah

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Thanks.
I am not in hurry about this as I have a lot of things to do so I will be happy if you can give some more advises when it is possible.
Draxin  
#4 Posted : Saturday, July 14, 2018 3:32:48 PM(UTC)
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Ok, well I restarted my MD subscription today, so may be able to find some more solutions. Probably won't be making an all out tutorial. More like a Tips and Tricks.


I have a couple questions about your project. These are mainly so I can try and recreate it and see the problems. Though I'll probably start working on something without these answers, simply because it's been nagging at me since I 1st saw the topic. lol


1) Are you using the most current version of MD?


2) Are you using a MD avatar (Supplied with program) or an Imported Avatar (like Genesis 3 or 8)?


That's pretty much all for MD and the Avatar.


3) Do you happen to know who makes or sells the bikini pictured, Wicked Weasel, ALS Scans, and so on, may have more images of the bikini?


Like I said I'll probably start on something similar as well as research more on the actual bikini pictured.


Lednah  
#5 Posted : Saturday, July 14, 2018 4:52:16 PM(UTC)
Lednah

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Originally Posted by: Draxin Go to Quoted Post


Ok, well I restarted my MD subscription today, so may be able to find some more solutions. Probably won't be making an all out tutorial. More like a Tips and Tricks.


I have a couple questions about your project. These are mainly so I can try and recreate it and see the problems. Though I'll probably start working on something without these answers, simply because it's been nagging at me since I 1st saw the topic. lol


1) Are you using the most current version of MD?


I use MD 6. If there is a need I can temporarily use MD 7 (my home PC is somewhat outdated for the last version to simulate smoothly).


Originally Posted by: Draxin Go to Quoted Post


2) Are you using a MD avatar (Supplied with program) or an Imported Avatar (like Genesis 3 or 8)?


I made my own avatars both G3 and G8 with arrangement points and bounding volumes for both with Daz ready poses. I actually enlarged the g3F Avatar bounding volumes to be able to work with more curvi females then the malnourished MD female avatars. No joints but if needed I can remake them with joints for poses only (as they use Daz rigging the animations should not be working).


Originally Posted by: Draxin Go to Quoted Post


That's pretty much all for MD and the Avatar.


 


3) Do you happen to know who makes or sells the bikini pictured, Wicked Weasel, ALS Scans, and so on, may have more images of the bikini?



The image I posted is from www.bikini-pleasure.com They produce several sets of such bikini each month for the last 7-8 years (both images and video). Quick search in google produces tons of those https://www.google.com/s...amp;biw=1920&bih=916


 



Draxin  
#6 Posted : Saturday, July 14, 2018 5:47:39 PM(UTC)
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They didn't add the Avatar Smoothing till 7.5, I believe. I think we can manage without it.


Well I did a sort of Quick and Dirty pattern still requires some tweaking, no rings or buckles, but here's what I came up with using my G8 Base with Glute Spread. I did smooth it once, but I'll go back and reload the avatar with out it.


 


Draxin attached the following image(s):
Micro Bikini Test.png
Micro Bikini Back Test.png
Draxin  
#7 Posted : Saturday, July 14, 2018 6:04:44 PM(UTC)
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Well that's what came up with for the time being, unfortunately at the moment I don't have an Avatar created for MD with genitals. It's in the works though. lol


The strings of what I made are actually 10 mm wide, I'll tinker around with it some more and see if I can get it closer to the pic.


Lednah  
#8 Posted : Saturday, July 14, 2018 7:34:14 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Draxin Go to Quoted Post


Well that's what came up with for the time being, unfortunately at the moment I don't have an Avatar created for MD with genitals. It's in the works though. lol


The strings of what I made are actually 10 mm wide, I'll tinker around with it some more and see if I can get it closer to the pic.



 


Just 10 mm default fabric w/o any tricks? What will happen if an avatar with normal glute put those already made bikini on?


 


As for the smoothing from what I see on MD 7.5 new features this is just subdivision. I presume it will make serious difference if you export Daz model with base mesh resolution but if it is in high resolutions (and both G3 and G8 are in high resolution by default) , it will not make any visible difference.

Edited by user Sunday, July 15, 2018 7:43:44 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Draxin  
#9 Posted : Saturday, July 14, 2018 8:02:49 PM(UTC)
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Yeah. the smoothing is just basically subdividing. I reloaded my Avatar without smoothing and got the same outcome.


I finished tinkering (well at least for tonight). I reduced the Strings to 5mm, added colors, and added cut-out and fill panels (with transparency), also made a top. I was going to post an update, then I saw your latest reply and tried it with another G8 Base without the Glute morph. Yeah, the back string does the jitterbug in the very narrow space between the glutes. Thankfully it didn't sink into the Avatar mesh. Just sat there bouncing back and forth. It did twist a bit as well. So maybe could get away with a smaller amount of glute adjustment.


I'll probably tinker with it more tomorrow. I don't like the way the back where the strings come together is acting. Probably just needs a bit of a curve.


Here's how it turned out.

Edited by user Saturday, July 14, 2018 8:08:33 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Draxin attached the following image(s):
Micro Bikini Test 01.png
Micro Bikini Back Test 01.png
Lednah  
#10 Posted : Sunday, July 15, 2018 5:13:26 AM(UTC)
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About the normal glute - the rule of thumb says the patterns should not *start* inside the mesh - but if you put the backstring *inside* the mesh where it should be and freeze it? So it actually not to be subject of the simulation at all?


Also when I try to sew etc the strings (i tried to pile them too) they twists too - although I tried to make the fabric very thick. From what I see from the other similar bikinis the strings there are not simple fabric strips.


 


PS. I've seen string models where the backstring is quite loose.

Edited by user Sunday, July 15, 2018 6:53:05 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Draxin  
#11 Posted : Sunday, July 15, 2018 1:14:00 PM(UTC)
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I try to keep the majority of the patterns outside the mesh of the Avatar. I'll include a pic of the 3D arrangement. The reason it's doing " The Jitterbug" and sometimes goes into the Avatar mesh in the normal glute pose is because the space is so narrow. It's trying to maintain the collision distance between the cloth and mesh as well as itself, and basically gets confused as to what to collide with. In a lot of cases the force of this "confusion" is enough to "push" the pattern into the mesh. Also the Avatar mesh has no flexibility, unlike real people. In order to have that, would basically require a super computer to calculate move all the parts. So we're stuck dressing Statues and Mannequins. Hope that clarified bit why it's dancing and twisting like it's being electrocuted.


What we are calling "Strings" are in fact folded and stitched strips of cloth, you can actually see this on the upper left of the triangle part in your pic. I've refrained from saying anything but I think she's actually wearing the bottoms inside out. I'm no Seamstress, but the the closest sewing term I can think of is a Hem, like at the bottom of the legs on a pair of pants or jeans. I have had 0 luck making these in MD, well except with much wider strips 100+ mm wide total and 50 mm folded, but it never fails some part of the folded piece goes into itself. So I try to avoid making them. Adding internal pressure sometimes fixes it but often causes an unwanted "balloon" effect. If the piece isn't "sealed" by sewing. It tries to fly away like a blown up balloon released without tying the end. Actually had this happen while trying to make a pillow in MD. lol 


Here's the 3D Arrangement view of the bottoms. The bottom string is 5mm wide x 200 mm long. I know the pattern goes into the mesh slightly in the front, thankfully it pops out of the mesh during simulation. Need to adjust the Crotch bounding volume on this Avatar.


Oh, and even with the Glute spread the string sometimes dances a bit, a light tug during simulation often settles it down.

Edited by user Sunday, July 15, 2018 1:18:06 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Draxin attached the following image(s):
3D Arrangement View Front.png
3D Arrangement View Back.png
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